eCommerce in SE Asia

Japan's eCommerce space is dominated by established brands, so it is likely one of those countries with high entry barriers. In a country with such a deep cultural foundation as Japan, it is understandable. But that is not something to fear; it only means there are still untapped opportunities waiting to be discovered.  Nate Shurilla, Head of APAC at Pacvue and Global Head of e-Commerce at Shiseido is with us today. In this episode, he shares exciting and significant insights about Japan's eCommerce, especially on four general drivers of consumer behaviors in online and offline businesses, as well as the big thing in Southeast Asia. He sees dynamism and innovative spirit in full swing now and in the coming years that will spur massive opportunities for many businesses and growth in the e-Commerce space. You'll learn: How has life been lately living in Tokyo [02:27] For what reason he came to APac and stay for years [03:11]  Sharing about Japan from an e-Commerce perspective [04:33] Major eCommerce platforms in Japan [07:05] One word to best describe how it is like to be at the helm of things as global head of e-Commerce [08:07] Important insights on foreign DTC brands' launches in Japan [11:12] Why South East Asia is an important game player in e-Commerce [15:14] What mainly differentiates Asia Pacific from the US and Japanese markets [17:26] Valuable advice for e-Commerce startups and existing brands [21:16] Interesting and also significant observations about the E-commerce future in Japan, Southeast Asia, and globally [23:28] Seeing a big shift in advertising in Southeast Asian commerce [using retailer data for social media platform consumer targeting, AI image evolution] [35:32]  Talking about Pacvue and where you can reach Nate [42:14] What was mentioned: Nate Shurilla: Website / LinkedIn Helium 10  PipeCandy Yahoo Shopping Rakuten Jiro Dreams of Sushi Yodobashi Camera Zozo Walmart Instacart Best Buy Woolworth Carrefour Uber Eats Getty Shutterstock Kroger Snapchat McKinsey CitrusAd Amazon Criteo Ideas worth sharing: "Japan, it's very dominated by established businesses. There's not as large of a startup scene or like hackers and hustlers or dropshippers, for example. So in that sense, it's a very, kind of like conservative and established market." - Nate Shurilla "You're always getting distracted by what's going on in all the different markets. There is no one-size-fits-all solution that will make everyone happy. So you have to have a certain level of understanding for how these different brands and different markets operate." - Nate Shurilla "So when you try to take something that's very culturally relevant in one market and put it into a completely different culture, there's a lot of work that needs to be done to translate and get the point across in that new area." - Nate Shurilla "I think with a lot of big brands, you tend to get very introspective and get a bit biased, I think, in your opinion of it. But the consumer could have a completely different opinion. So it's really important to get as close to the consumer as you can and understand what's making them tick, what they need, and what they don't need. And then make sure that you get that message to them on why you can help them get to where they want to go." - Nate Shurilla "I saw Southeast Asia as a massive opportunity, especially in the number one Asia-based cosmetics company. With how fast it was growing, how close it was to Japan, and being an Asia-central business, I saw a lot of opportunities there." - Nate Shurilla "Southeast Asia is very dynamic. They have lots of experiments and lots of new things going on. And there's adoption for these new types of commerce and experiences." - Nate Shurilla "A lot of these markets have been around or have had a high standard of living for quite some time, like Japan, the US, Europe, etc.; they're very established in their ways. And they're very kind of stubborn, almost in their behavior. So when there are new opportunities, such as social commerce, such as quick commerce, and things like voice search that we would do back in the day, it's very different -- the adoption that you see in the markets." - Nate Shurilla "Don't be too afraid of barriers." - Nate Shurilla "There's going to be a continued kind of proliferation of E-retail, delivering omnichannel in-store, out-of-store connected solutions." - Nate Shurilla "I think that like those types of E-retailers coming online, combining their online and offline offerings into something that's consumer-centric, and not like siloed, by channel or whatever, is going to be quite interesting in Southeast Asia and most of the world." - Nate Shurilla

As a result of the global scenario that has affected everyone for almost three years now, businesses have had a difficult time doing business. Despite unfavorable market conditions, Thailand has seen steady growth in its eCommerce market. In this episode, Nuttapon Boonpinon of nsquaredasia discusses how he found opportunities in rising inflation and shrinking buying power. He talks about eCommerce platforms that have contributed to Thailand's fast eCommerce performance and how influencers and brand partnerships have given it a new shape. Interestingly, he also made personal forecasts on the market players at the forefront of Thailand's eCommerce arena three years from now, including its percentage estimate for retail sales each year. You'll learn: A backstory of what led to the creation of [03:01] One notable observation about Thailand's E-commerce in the past year or two[08:40] The reason behind quick E-commerce proliferation [where grocery items are concerned] in Bangkok[14:59] Influencers and partnerships are giving steady rise to E-commerce business in Thailand[20:19]  Becoming TikTok shop's leading partner in Thailand and how this platform has shown authenticity in its content and provide a measurable way of tracking a brand's marketing efforts [27:45]  Percentage estimate of eCommerce retail sales in the next three years [32:29] Recommended eCommerce platforms for startup brands looking to do business in Thailand[36:41] What was mentioned: Nuttapon Boonpinon: Website/ TikTok 2C2P Shopify Woocommerce Ideas worth sharing: "In the first month, we started online selling, we had USD200 in sales, and now we have become more than 120 million US per year. It has been quite a journey." - Nuttapon Boonpinon "What we see is that with the lower spending power of the customer, we see an opportunity as well. People are more cautious about their spending. Both shrinking wallets and inflation have heavily hit the big-ticket items. But the greater E-commerce adoption has brought us to what I call the final frontier of E-commerce which is grocery. It has low-value density, and this sector, food, and beverage have been growing tremendously from 40 to 50% and is still growing at the same rate as last year." - Nuttapon Boonpinon "Tiktok is a good platform in terms of creating demand." - Nuttapon Boonpinon "One thing I noticed about the TickTok shop platform is, they're non- subsidized for a long time. This is healthy as well. TikTok shop in Thailand, I believe in August, they start collecting a payment fee of 3%. It indicates that from October, they start collecting their commission fee."  - Nuttapon Boonpinon "I believe Tik Tok got it right to integrate the social and transactional parts seamlessly so you can enjoy swiping through their videos." - Nuttapon Boonpinon "[With TikTok] not only is where a creator can earn money directly if not indirectly. With sponsorship, a creator can earn direct commission from the brand, which is the most effective way for brands to measure their marketing efforts through real user-generated content and a pay-per-purchase." - Nuttapon Boonpinon "In three years, eCommerce penetrate sales percentages as around 20 to 25% share of retail sales. We see growth at an estimate of about 20% each year." - Nuttapon Boonpinon "In Thailand, we expect to see the main two marketplace players, Shopee and Lazada will still be the duopoly. I see no imminent market player. But Tik Tok would be in the same scale and size as that of Shopee and Lazada today." - Nuttapon Boonpinon

Former Lazada Indonesia co-CEO Duri Granziol has launched consumer goods brand Mama's Choice in Indonesia with plans to expand across Southeast Asia. The brand seeks to appeal to expecting and new mothers by providing safe, halal and natural personal care products at an affordable price point. In this episode, Duri shares significant ideas, thoughts, and insights on brand creation and product development. More than the experience approach of most for building a brand, he chose to embark on a data-driven perspective in conducting research and study to know the market and its demand. There was no reason to reinvent the wheel of what big companies are doing, thus, utilizing third parties to manufacture products. He provides valuable thoughts on what sales channel mix to use where selling and marketing are concerned. And he doubles down on finding a brand's unique selling point as a differentiating factor from the rest of the market. And for the business to stay in the game for the long term.  You'll learn:  A backstory of how he ended up in Southeast Asia E-commerce [01:04] The time he started working for Lazada and how he described the early days of Lazada [02:08] Sharing the story that led to establishing his own company Mama's Choice [04:31] How it was like building a brand in its early stages [07:29] Becoming the market leader online in just six months of starting the brand [10:23] Taking a look at the products' manufacturing process [13:03] Challenges and struggles the company has to face and overcome [14:05] Brand-building comparison in Southeast Asia, the US, and Europe [16:12] Sales channel mix the brand uses [18:54] Platforms they spend more on for brand awareness(plus how the difference between content used in FB and IG versus TikTok matter in terms of effectiveness and affordability) [22:55] Setting up operations in the five markets that they are present [26:11] Important angles to look at when doing product development [31:01] Banking on long-term differentiation [33:46] What he sees to be happening in Southeast Asia E-commerce from now on [36:37] Mentions: Duri Granziol: LinkedIn Mama'sChoiceShop.com  Mama'sChoice.id Roshni Mahtani Cheung The Asian Parent TikTok Shoppee Lazada Facebook Instagram Key Takeaways: "The strategy was to go in some niches where we felt it was easier to enter and then go into more competitive categories later. We were looking at the needs of mothers that were currently unmet and trying to find a better solution for that." - Duri Granziol "It was a given that we're going to start manufacturing locally. But then I realized Unilever, P & G, and everybody has outsourcing providers. They have factories that are owned and operated by third parties. And I just went to these guys." - Duri Granziol "I didn't need to spend so much time on quality control because I already knew these guys were also producing for Unilever and P&G, so they were inspected, they knew what they were doing. I added another safety level by having all the products shipped to Singapore and doing extra tests in a third-party lab."- Duri Granziol

Josh Gardner is the co-founder of KungfuData, an on-shore digital brand accelerator with a portfolio of successful lifestyle brands on China’s major digital platforms. From market entry to omnichannel operations in China. With his extensive experience working in and out of China for many years, he has the most significant and detailed perspective on China's eCommerce and digital marketing climate.  According to him, what's happening in Southeast Asia now has already occurred in China five years ago. They're way ahead in the eCommerce space. He suggests taking a closer look at the ground, studying and seeing what they do in China that worked out—and then charting a design for your eCommerce business that would make sense for you and the Southeast Asian market. You'll learn: What brought him to China, the jobs he had before ending up in e-commerce [02:29] Talking about KungFu Data, what it is about, and the many iterations happening before finally making it (including valuable thoughts on how to make it in China) [8:23] Take a look at China's digital ecosystem now and the factors that impacted the different brands' performance [26:48] The overall business climate in China and how foreign businesses coming in are affected[36:07] The mindset of most businesses entering China that's headed for failure[42:04] Eye-opening critical differentiators of the Chinese market from the EU and US markets[53:09] Valuable tips and advice any startup and current business owners in Southeast Asia should pay attention to[01:01:12] How to stay updated with developments in China (helpful resources you can use) [01:08:32] Where to find Josh and get updated about China[01:11:54] What was mentioned: Josh Gardner: Website Douyin Alibaba TaoBao WeChat Ideas worth sharing: "Humility and respect for where you're going in are the two most profound traits; an open mind and change are the other ones. That's what I see with people who do well in China and probably any other market they're going into that's not their home market. That should lead you to good things in your life, especially in business expansion in the Asia Pacific." - Josh Gardner "The digital integrations and merging the worlds completely to protect your core commerce, your business, whether online or offline. That's a significant movement right now and on the ground." - Josh Gardner "China is a high-risk market because most people going in have truly a low level of understanding of what needs to happen to make China viable. Even the conditions for success are not well understood. And that's really where people get into trouble." - Josh Gardner "Instead of working on P&L, what I tell people to work on is category leadership. Can you be a top-five brand in a subcategory or multiple subcategories? The answer to that question is everything. Because everything you do down the line to get that leadership position is about building an unfair advantage." - Josh Gardner "Three-quarters of our brands are in their top five, and at least most of their subcategories are top 10 in bigger categories. But they didn't start that way. And that's because it's not like status and success in China. It's not a birthright; just because you're famous outside China doesn't matter. Building unfair advantage and defendable positions in China is a process that is hard-earned." - Josh Gardner

While there may be some friction in doing business in other Southeast Asian countries, this is not the case in Malaysia.  In many ways, it has to do with its openness to foreign trade and international commerce. It's no wonder it's filled with brands from a range of industry players, both domestic and foreign.  Having fewer restrictions on foreign investment and ownership rules could likely attract foreign investments that would spark a bustling economy. Today we are joined by our guest Hans-Peter Ressel of MomentumCommerce.com, as he talks about the prevailing e-commerce climate in Malaysia, especially at this time. In this episode, he shares the ease and smoothness of doing business in Malaysia and how the cost of living is much lesser here. But as a very diverse country with a population coming from three major groups of Muslims, Chinese, and Indians, that's where the challenge comes and where his valuable insights and thoughts come in handy.  And one interesting thing to take advantage of is his foreseeing of Malaysia's e-commerce and where it is headed five years from now. With the entry of TikTok Shop, which is fast catching up with Shoppee and Lazada, that indeed will open gaps that need to be filled in by service providers and unlock many more opportunities for entrepreneurs. You'll learn: How has life been with Hans now that the world is opening up[01:05] The reason why he started Momentum Commerce [03:59] Why should one consider Malaysia an excellent place to start one's e-commerce business[07:15]  What defines Malaysia's openness to cross-border, international e-commerce, and foreign trade[11:31] What remains unchanged through the years and what has shifted in Malaysia's e-commerce landscape[14:23] Momentum is becoming the number one service provider for TikTok Malaysia [18:18] Observations on why Tiktok has gone into driving traffic to conversion within the platform while Facebook didn't, even if it's been around for many years now [21:42] What an efficient supply chain warehouse setup looks like[25:53] Mistakes foreign brands are committing when entering the Malaysian market [29:08] Brand-building activities to increase market brand awareness for those starting from scratch[32:43] Differentiating the EU and US e-commerce from Southeast Asia[35:09] Valuable advice for a startup brand and current brand that just newly got into the Malaysian market[43:44] Where he sees Malaysia's e-commerce going five or more years from now [47:52] Mentions: Hans-Peter Ressel: Website Jack Ma Lazada Shopee TikTok Shop Ideas worth sharing: "The openness to having foreign investments is very high [in Malaysia]. If you compare it to some other markets where you have a lot of foreign investment and ownership rules, high restrictions to incorporate the business in certain protected industries, and lots of requirements for high paid-up capital; those barriers are much lower in Malaysia. - Hans Peter Ressel "I feel nothing has changed. It is a very competitive environment. When Lazada came into the picture, there were some local incumbents, and Lazada took over them. It became number one, and Shoppee took over and, by now, probably is the biggest incumbent. This year, the biggest shift is, TikTok has been there for a couple of years as a social media platform, but with the launch of the TikTok shop and the whole incubation of the ecosystem around TikTok service providers, we have seen a dramatic shift and an increase of the importance of that new social commerce environment."- Hans-Peter Ressel "When you look into the people now working at TikTok Malaysia, many ex-Lazada and Shopee colleagues are there. You can see the strategic focus on making that social media platform a big e-commerce platform, which works. We started to focus on this in early March, and by now, roughly a little bit more than half a year, some of our clients, Tiktok, is already the number two platform behind Shopee and ahead of Lazada." - Hans-Peter Ressel "TikTok became, for us, not only just another channel or just another service. It has allowed us to not only deepen our relationship with existing clients but also start initiating new relationships with new clients that, in the past, didn't see the need to talk to us because of other engagements or internal capabilities."- Hans-Peter Ressel "For us, it's very exciting because, after all these years of, pretty much in Malaysia, Lazada and Shopee dominating, and Zalora in the fashion space, there is now a new player [TikTok Shop] which kind of shakes up the tree a bit. Then everyone starts to motion, shift around, and assess what that means for them." - Hans-Peter Ressel "I think that for us is a process that we have to go through where we really have to explain to those brands that reputation in France, Italy, or Germany doesn't mean too much if you don't go through the motions of building your brand in Southeast Asia as well."- Hans-Peter Ressel "Malaysia itself is a diverse market; you have the Malays, the majority of the population, 65 to 70% are predominantly Muslims, you have the Chinese demographics, the Indian demographics. Even within Malaysia, the way you position yourself can be very diverse. That's something that people often underestimate -- real local engagement with the demographic you want to cater to or where you feel you have the strongest connection with. And the biggest opportunity is very important, not only across countries within Southeast Asia but even across demographics within Malaysia." - Hans-Peter Ressel "I also see that Southeast Asia, with all the algorithms and all the social commerce activities, really allows for smaller local brands to rise."- Hans-Peter Ressel "In our industry with a strong focus on e-commerce and starting and building a brand, focusing on unit economics and having a robust and scalable business model is key." - Hans-Peter Ressel

In this face of global competition, how can SE e-commerce sellers remain competitive and ride the eCommerce wave? Ken Leaver started in consulting with 7 years at BCG, then moved to the commercial world (CEO of Group Ukraine, ran a $50m issue product biz for visa). He previously was SVP Product at Lazada, Director of Product at Wayfair, and Head of Product at Pomelo Fashion.  He’s also a serial entrepreneur and now spends his time on his startup (therapada.com, an online therapy marketplace) and consulting different (mostly eCommerce businesses) in the region on product management and operations technology. In the past 5 years, he’s helped Ozon, Yandex, BRANDED, Shipper, Wasoko, Ezie.app, Delami, Rainforest. Always at the CEO/CPO/CTO level, typically driving projects himself. Ken is most famous for his incredible organizational systems and disciplines which he calls “seal tactics” and has been a big help/mentor. In this episode, Ken Leaver shares valuable insights and thoughts on the challenges and good opportunities in the Southeast Asian region's e-commerce space. He believes that there are more new generations of independent creators nowadays looking into creating their communities, and content and building their own brands to sell to, thus, we see an e-commerce landscape making a lot of difference three to five years down the road. Topics Covered: Ken's journey to Southeast Asia and why he chose to stay [01:59] Compared with the US and Europe, how did SE Asia's e-commerce business landscape look [05:15] The complexity of finding product differentiation from the supply chain in the SEA region [11:23] Creating product differentiation [12:29] Not just a random way but an analytical process of making decisions about product differentiation [14:10] Achieving product-market fit [15:00] The most a start-up can do when you want to penetrate Southeast Asian e-commerce [ 18:37] Seeing the Southeast Asian e-commerce landscape five years down the road [19:59] The two competencies where you see Southeast Asian region is fast scaling  [22:32] Ways of creating a business and scaling it that not everybody agrees on [26:49] People and Resources Mentioned: - Alibaba - Taobao - Facebook - Instagram -Tiktok  - The Kardashians Ideas Worth Sharing/ Quotable Quote: [on SE Asia’s Uniqueness] "I was sitting in a macroeconomic class at Cornell. And they were just showing how GDP per capita in Asia was so low, and it was increasing quickly. In the US, it was already high. These things would more or less converge as education and technology were available to both. Given these dynamics, I knew the place to be was in a developing country like Southeast Asia." - Ken Leaver "Southeast Asian sellers are sourcing products locally, allowing their supply chain to be relatively not complex. They're starting to think, how do I find a differentiated product in my supply chain? That's where I think the next wave of evolution is." - Ken Leaver [First world countries approach on product-market fit] " I'm going to create product differentiation, but to determine what kind of differentiation it is, I need to be more advanced analytically. And I think that is the other thing that is coming here." - Ken Leaver [on product-market fit]" Don't just assume like everybody else's dumb and your ideas like nobody's thought about it, and instead make sure you've systematically done your homework on what are the similar models in other countries that have made it and then do your reverse engineering." - Ken Leaver "You're going to see more and more of these young, independent content creators; they're not worried about the career path; they want to create their own brands. And I think that will change the Southeast Asian landscape a lot." - Ken Leaver "In the past year, there's never been as much movement or excitement going towards influencers, affiliates, referrals, and partnerships." - Ken Leaver Connect wih Ken Leaver:   Website  LinkedIn

We live in a world that is changing rapidly, and e-commerce and social media are no exception. Among the new marketing strategies emerging are influencer marketing, which is now considered a fast driver of online sales. How, then, do you leverage its rising popularity? Join Thibault Eiffel, Co-Founder, and CEO of Capssion.com, as he shares how to use social media for e-commerce selling, considering influencer marketing's big show up in the scene.  Understand how repeat collaborations strengthen brand support rather than one-offs. And that capitalizing on authenticity where influencer strategy is concerned makes way for a long-term relationship to exist long after the limited partnership ends. You'll learn: Thibault background as an industry expert in ecommerce, what led him to start Capssion and enter the influencer marketing field [00:50] The search and sourcing of winning ecommerce products [03:36] Understanding influencer marketing [07:18] Influencer marketing tie-in or connection to macroeconomic issues and profitability [09:06] An influencer campaign's key steps [11:58] Things to consider when partnering with an influencer and doing cross-platform content [16:58] Influencer compensation models [18:47]  What brand stakeholders should watch out for in the creator/influencer economy before partnering with them [22:44] Partnering with influencers whose audiences are your current customers [25:38] Differentiating Southeast Asian region's influencer strategies compared to US and European countries  [27:30] Influencer marketing tips for eCommerce startups, things to consider when running campaigns [31:46] In five years, how will influencer marketing look in Southeast Asia?  [34:48] Two essential factors startups in SE Asia need to focus on when looking at their marketing campaigns where monthly promos are concerned [35:34] If you are to create a new brand from scratch, how will you look at  growing your brand via influencer marketing 37:34 What was mentioned: Thibault Eiffel: Website | LinkedIn Twitter TikTok Instagram Facebook Lazada Shoppee Ideas Worth Sharing: "A lot of the brands are coming back to the fundamental where they ask themselves, the person that I'm working with, they need to look like my end consumer because the likelihood that the people who follow this influencer will look like them is very high." - Thibault Eiffel "We're now towards quality collaborations more than quantity collaborations."- Thibault Eiffel "We are also shifting from one-off collaborations to repeat collaborations. We are in an industry, even though it's a numbers game, you are interacting with real people."- Thibault Eiffel "Nobody's an expert in this social media; nobody can claim to know how to end the game. It is constantly changing; you need to iterate, you need to test, and you need to work with different people as well because you might not know that a certain type of campaign or certain type of content might work better for your brand."- Thibault Eiffel "The number one thing you need when you're a brand is to understand number one, and that's the most important thing why you're doing this campaign."- Thibault Eiffel "There are so many angles that you can approach a campaign that if you are not clear about what you want, or if you want to multiply the objectives too much, you are set to fail."- Thibault Eiffel "Go for what the platform is strong for, depending on what you have listed before your objectives, your customer, and what you want out of this campaign, understand the strengths and weaknesses of each platform and know why you're selecting the platform and the specific type of content and the rest of that flow.- Thibault Eiffel "Ecommerce and social media will merge they will converge because the second you discover products on social media, it feels unnatural to ask people to leave the social media platform to buy." - Thibault Eiffel

Matthew Schone, together with his peers interview eCommerce & digital marketing experts, entrepreneurs, & leaders to give insights into the world of SE Asia eCommerce and what brands, sellers, & agencies do to get ahead. Each episode is filled with actionable advice, data-backed growth tactics, and fresh insights you can apply to your business. eCommerce is growing in SE Asia faster than anywhere else in the world. But, just like elsewhere, it changes fast and the tools, tactics, & strategies that get you ahead change too. Join Matt weekly as he interviews eCommerce & digital marketing experts & leaders from across SE Asia. Get a weekly dose of ideas to solve your eCommerce & digital marketing challenges. Listen to weekly episodes at https://www.splitdragon.com/podcast