Time on Wing Podcast

Ian discusses his roles at SH&E and GECAS, the challenges he faced in consulting, and his transition to Brigade Capital where he learned about aircraft leasing and finance. He also delves into the helicopter leasing market, the establishment of Waypoint, and the impact of fluctuating oil prices on the industry. The discussion concludes with insights on the grounding of the EC-225 and its implications for investors. In this conversation, Ian discusses the complexities of the aviation industry, particularly focusing on aircraft groundings, risk management, and the dynamics of the helicopter market.  He shares insights on the founding of Avian, a company aimed at providing capital solutions around inventory in aviation. The discussion also touches on the competitive landscape of aviation financing, the importance of building relationships, and the challenges of educating the market about innovative inventory solutions. Ian reflects on his journey and the future direction of Avian, emphasizing the need for adaptability and strategic thinking in a rapidly changing industry.

Steve Hennigan shares his evolution from a pilot to a leader in airport operations. He pulls back the curtain on the complexities of managing hubs like Denver, Houston, and RSW—discussing everything from engineering runways for the Boeing 777X and navigating complex financial strategies to weathering hurricanes and planning for the future of travel.  Steve recounts his journey from flying for FedEx and United to overseeing major airport operations. This episode dives into the business side of aviation, covering the strategic planning required for future infrastructure, the financial intricacies of bond refinancing and FAA funding, and the daily challenges of balancing market demands at RSW and Pagefield. Tune in for a behind-the-scenes look at how airports manage growth, natural disasters, and the passenger experience. 

Aaron Prothero shares his journey into the aviation industry, influenced by his family's background.   Aaron discusses Aerolease's unique investment approach in aviation and in other alternative assets. We discuss the competitive landscape of trading in aviation, particularly focusing on the A330 market. Aaron shares insights on investment strategies, the impact of COVID-19 on the aviation industry, and the resurgence of the A330-300 as a viable aircraft.  The episode also covers challenges in maintenance, repair, and operations (MRO), the future of widebody aircraft, and the evolving cargo market. Prothero emphasizes the importance of luck, strategic timing, and controlling feedstock in navigating the complexities of the aviation market.

Jeremy Barnes shares his unconventional journey from banking to aviation, emphasizing the importance of analytical thinking and strategic partnerships in the aircraft leasing industry. He discusses the challenges faced during the early 90s, the evolution of Falko, and the significance of building relationships in the regional aviation market.  Jeremy also highlights misconceptions about regional aviation and the need for a better understanding and valuation of the sector. In this conversation, Jeremy discusses the complexities and challenges of the regional aircraft market, including managing engine lifecycles, pursuing strategic acquisitions, and understanding customer needs. He emphasizes the significance of disciplined growth and the challenges of capital deployment in the aviation industry. The discussion also touches on the future of firefighting aircraft and the finite nature of regional aircraft production, highlighting the economic realities of developing new aircraft.

Gary Weissel shares his extensive journey in the aviation industry, detailing his transition from aspiring doctor to aerospace engineer, his significant tenure at Delta Air Lines, and his eventual move into consulting and founding Tronos. He discusses the challenges and experiences he faced in various roles, including asset management and working with VIP aircraft, providing insights into the complexities of the aviation sector.  Gary delves into the intricacies of aircraft completion centers, the artistry involved in VIP aircraft interiors, and the challenges of valuing these high-end modifications. We discuss innovations in aerial firefighting aircraft and the training of new engineers in the aviation industry. The conversation also touches on the complexities of navigating supply chain issues and certification processes in aircraft manufacturing. The complexities and challenges faced in the aviation industry, particularly focusing on regulatory compliance, certification processes, and the current supply chain issues, are also discussed. Gary highlights the importance of navigating regulatory challenges, the intricacies of compliance walks, and the impact of engineering bottlenecks on production capacity.  Weissel also addresses the critical role of data access in retrofitting aircraft and the ongoing challenges in the supply chain, emphasizing the need for effective strategies to overcome these obstacles. We discuss the significant challenges faced in the aviation industry, particularly regarding layoffs and their impact on knowledge retention, the delivery strategies of Airbus and Boeing, the complexities of freighter conversions, and the unique challenges posed by modifying carbon fiber fuselages. 

Subodh Karnik shares his extensive career journey in the aviation industry, detailing his experiences from being a management consultant to working with major airlines like Northwest, Continental, and Delta. He discusses the impact of antitrust immunity on airline partnerships, the challenges faced by Caribbean airlines like Air Jamaica, and the emergence of new players like Arojet. The conversation also touches on the effects of 9/11 on Delta Airlines and the evolving landscape of low-cost carriers like Spirit Airlines. In this conversation, Courtney Miller and Subodh Karnik delve into the evolving landscape of the airline industry post-COVID, discussing the dynamics of low-cost carriers, market disruptions, and the impact of geopolitical events. They explore the future of airline business models, the role of loyalty programs, and the economic challenges facing airlines today. The discussion highlights the need for innovation in airline operations and the potential for disruption in loyalty programs as the industry adapts to changing consumer behaviors and economic conditions.

In this episode, we sit down with Ryan Goepel, CEO of Global X (Global Crossing Airlines), to uncover the incredible story of building a successful charter airline from the ground up during a global pandemic. Ryan shares his unconventional journey from the finance and oil & gas industries to the C-suite of an airline—a transition kick-started by simply being "the Canadian guy" they needed for an investment. Learn about Global X's "hedgehog strategy" of flying "forgettable flights" and how their unique business model allows them to thrive by de-risking operations and maximizing the value of mid-to-late life aircraft. From harrowing rescue missions in Afghanistan during their first week of operation to a long-term bet on the A321 freighter market, this is a masterclass in scrappy, disciplined, and opportunistic growth in one of the world's toughest industries.

Richard discusses the evolving landscape of the aviation industry, focusing on the significant changes in the defense sector and their implications for commercial aviation. He emphasizes the importance of NATO alliances, the challenges posed by geopolitical tensions, and the need for new aircraft designs to meet market demands. The conversation also touches on engineering talent shortages, the role of AI, and the growing influence of China in global defense dynamics. Richard provides insights from the latest Air Show and highlights the mid-market aircraft opportunity as a key area for future growth.

Eric Tanner shares his lifelong passion for aviation, detailing his journey from a childhood obsession to a successful career in the airline industry. He discusses his educational background, the challenges he faced in network planning, and the unique dynamics of working at Flair Airlines amidst a competitive landscape. The conversation highlights the blend of art and science in aviation, emphasizing the importance of relationships and strategic thinking in network planning.  Eric discusses the challenges and strategies in the airline industry, particularly focusing on revenue management, the dynamics of the North American market, and the economics of aircraft operations. He emphasizes the importance of understanding market needs and competition, as well as the implications of being a low-cost carrier in a highly regulated environment. The discussion also touches on the concept of being the 'last man standing' in the aviation sector and the complexities of aircraft leasing and operational strategies.  We discuss the complexities of airport gate allocations, the strategic importance of airports as community assets, and the operational challenges faced by airlines. He emphasizes the need for a thoughtful approach to air service and highlights the role of loyalty programs in airline profitability. Tanner also reflects on the hubris associated with entering the airline industry and the necessity of operationalizing ideas in a geographically dispersed environment.

Donna Ager is our guest for this podcast - a legal expert in aviation. We discuss various aspects of aviation law, including the challenges faced by women in the field, the impact of AI on the industry, and the importance of networking and building connections. 

Phil Bolger shares his extensive journey in the aviation industry, detailing his early influences, the challenges he faced, and the evolution of aircraft leasing. He discusses the strategic growth of GPA, the dynamics of aircraft financing, and the innovations that have shaped the market. Phil also reflects on the role of leasing in airline operations and offers insights into the future of the industry. This conversation delves into the evolution of aircraft leasing, highlighting the significant changes in financing structures, the role of joint ventures, and the impact of sale-leasebacks on the industry. The discussion also covers the risks and challenges faced by lessors today, the importance of maintenance in leasing agreements, and the dynamics of access to capital in the aviation market. In this conversation, the speakers delve into the current state and future of the aviation leasing market, discussing the lack of innovation in financing, the role of leasing companies, and the importance of understanding residual values and engine management. They explore the dynamics of regional aircraft, the impact of M&A trends, and the strategies that lessors can adopt to navigate the evolving landscape. The discussion highlights the significance of technical knowledge in driving value and the challenges of accurately appraising aircraft and engines. 

Phil Seymour shares his extensive journey in aviation, starting from his childhood under the flight path of Heathrow Airport to his career at British Airways and beyond. He discusses the challenges and transitions he faced, including the impact of economic downturns on the aviation industry, his experiences living abroad, and the founding of an airline. Phil also highlights the importance of adaptability and innovation in navigating the complexities of the aviation sector. In this conversation, Phil Seymour discusses his journey in the aviation industry, emphasizing the importance of innovation, data analytics, and leadership during crises. He reflects on the evolution of IBA, the significance of passion and consistency in leadership, and the changing dynamics between appraisers and OEMs. The discussion highlights the need for a data-driven approach in aviation and the opportunities that arise from adapting to new technologies and market demands. In this conversation, Phil Seymour discusses the complexities of aircraft valuation, financing decisions, and the impact of tariffs on the aviation industry. The discussion delves into market dynamics, order book implications, and the challenges posed by economic uncertainty. The speakers also explore the future of aviation, aircraft deliveries, and the nuances of valuation in a fluctuating economic landscape. 

Conor McCarthy shares his journey in aviation, starting from his apprenticeship at Aer Lingus at the age of 16. He discusses his early experiences, the challenges he faced, and his rise through the ranks to become an executive. Conor highlights the transformative period for Aer Lingus with the introduction of the Airbus A330, the challenges posed by competitors like Ryanair, and the strategic decisions made to adapt to the evolving aviation landscape. His insights reflect a deep passion for the industry and a commitment to innovation and progress.

In this conversation, Ken Newton shares his extensive experience in the aviation industry, detailing his journey from the Marine Corps to Alaska Airlines. He discusses the evolution of Alaska Airlines, the importance of safety culture, and the challenges faced during mergers and integrations. Ken also addresses the current state of engine technology, supply chain challenges, and the future of the airline industry as he prepares for retirement. Ken discusses his path through the Marine Corps, Flying Tigers, FedEx, and Alaska Airlines. The conversation focuses on engines, including Ken's experience with the CFM56 and the new LEAP-1B. We also discuss the future of engine programs, reliability, and fuel burn.

David shares his journey in the aviation industry, detailing his transition from a sales assistant to the founder of Setna IO. He discusses the challenges faced during the COVID-19 pandemic, the strategic decisions made to navigate the crisis, and the subsequent growth of his company. Chaimovitz emphasizes the importance of understanding the market, building relationships, and maintaining a proactive approach in business. He also shares insights on the future of the aviation industry and the potential for continued growth despite challenges.  David discusses the intricacies of managing aircraft parts and the MRO business, emphasizing the importance of data-driven decision-making and understanding market dynamics. He highlights the challenges faced in the industry, including the complexities of aircraft tear down and parts recovery, and the need for diverse buyer perspectives. Additionally, Chaimovitz shares insights on how population trends may impact the aviation industry and offers a future outlook for his company and the sector as a whole.

Evan details his journey through various roles in aircraft financing and consulting. We discuss the evolution of the aviation industry, the impact of financial innovations, and the significant changes brought about by events like 9/11. The speaker also highlights their recent work in forecasting and consulting within the aircraft ABS market, showcasing their expertise and insights into the industry's future. This conversation delves into the complexities of the aviation finance market, focusing on the dynamics of asset-backed securities (ABS) and the evolving landscape post-COVID. The speakers discuss investment opportunities, the impact of global events on aviation, and the resilience of the industry amidst various crises. They also explore the differences between current ABS structures and those from the past, highlighting the importance of cash flow certainty and the potential for innovative financing solutions for lessors. In this conversation, the speakers delve into the current state of the aircraft ABS market, discussing innovative leasing structures, the impact of COVID-19, and future trends in aircraft valuation. They explore the dynamics of secondary trading, risk assessment in investments, and the implications of changing lease structures on the market. The discussion highlights the importance of understanding market trends and the potential opportunities that arise in the evolving landscape of aviation finance.

We welcome back Mark Streeter and Jamie Baker from JP Morgan Chase.  We discuss what happened in 2024 and what's likely to happen in 2025 in commercial aviation. The conversation provides a comprehensive update on the airline industry, focusing on market trends, capacity discipline, leasing strategies, and financial maneuvers such as sale leasebacks. The speakers discuss the implications of these factors for 2024 and beyond, highlighting the evolving dynamics of the airline market and the influence of OEMs on capacity and leasing strategies. They also reflect on unexpected developments in aircraft recovery and the overall financial health of airlines. In this conversation, the speakers delve into the complexities of airline profitability, particularly focusing on Spirit Airlines and its challenges in competing with major players like Delta. They discuss the evolving business models in the airline industry, emphasizing the shift from traditional loyalty programs to more currency-like systems. The conversation also touches on consumer behavior, the changing dynamics of airline club experiences, and the cultural value that airlines like Southwest bring to the table. Looking ahead to 2025, the speakers share their predictions for the industry, highlighting potential shifts and opportunities.

In this conversation, Mike Platt and John Shavinsky share their diverse backgrounds in aviation, discussing their journeys from engineering to legal roles and the evolution of the aviation industry. They delve into the complexities of aircraft leasing, the challenges faced by airlines today, and the implications of current market dynamics on future aircraft orders. The discussion highlights the importance of experience and knowledge in navigating the aviation landscape, especially in light of recent industry changes. This conversation delves into the complexities of the aircraft leasing market, exploring the challenges faced by airlines and lessors in a rapidly changing economic landscape. The discussion highlights the long-term implications of aircraft orders, the competitive nature of leasing, and the need for flexibility in contracts. The speakers also reflect on the future of aircraft technology and the importance of strategic planning in the face of uncertainty. In this conversation, the speakers delve into the complexities of the aircraft leasing market, discussing the challenges of maintenance, the dynamics of aircraft pricing, and the future of airline economics. They explore the implications of rising costs for airlines, particularly in the context of Air India's growth and the broader aviation market. The discussion also touches on the role of lessors in managing aircraft and the challenges faced by OEMs in meeting delivery demands. Overall, the conversation provides valuable insights into the current state and future outlook of the aviation industry.

Brian Rynott shares his journey through the aviation industry, detailing his early passion for aviation, career transitions, and experiences at major companies like American Airlines and AWAS. He discusses the evolution of Intrepid Aviation and his current role, providing insights into the aviation landscape and personal anecdotes that shaped his career. In this conversation, Brian Rynott discusses his journey in the aviation industry, particularly during the COVID-19 pandemic. He emphasizes the importance of building long-term relationships with clients, understanding the intricacies of the business, and leveraging data to inform marketing strategies. Rynott also highlights the evolving role of airlines as strategic buyers of aircraft and the need for lessors to adapt to these changes. The discussion underscores the significance of personal interactions in a digital age and the value of adding insights beyond just financial metrics in business transactions. In this conversation, the speakers discuss the evolution of aircraft buying processes, the maturity of the leasing industry, and the rise of lessors and new financial structures. They explore the changes in the aviation finance landscape, the impact of market dynamics on leasing strategies, and the comparative analysis of aviation with other capital-intensive industries. The discussion highlights the importance of adapting to industry changes and the future outlook for aircraft leasing.

Summary In this conversation, Jochen Schnadt shares his lifelong passion for aviation, detailing his journey from aspiring pilot to air traffic controller, and eventually to founding JetMagic and Fly4 Airlines. He discusses the challenges faced in the airline industry, particularly during the COVID-19 pandemic, and the evolving consumer behavior that impacts travel patterns. Jochen emphasizes the importance of adaptability in aviation and reflects on the industry's need to improve its narrative regarding environmental challenges. The discussion also touches on the role of ACMI in modern aviation and the significance of understanding market dynamics. Takeaways Jochen's passion for aviation began at age six. He transitioned from aspiring pilot to air traffic controller. JetMagic faced challenges due to undercapitalization. The airline industry is complex and often frustrating. COVID-19 has fundamentally changed consumer behavior. ACMI has become a strategic tool for airlines post-COVID. Seasonality presents both risks and opportunities for airlines. Consumer preferences are shifting towards cooler destinations. The adaptability of the aviation industry is remarkable. The industry needs to improve its public relations regarding environmental impact. Sound Bites "I was 20 years younger and had more energy." "The adaptability of the industry is just unbelievable." "COVID has been a catalyst for seismic shifts."